BSMX's Official Mexican National Team Random Thoughts Thread vol. II

Discussion in 'Mexico National Team' started by DGreat, Feb 17, 2014.

  1. Rafael Hernandez

    Rafael Hernandez Moderator
    Staff Member

    Mar 6, 2002
    Lazy as ********ing hell. The idea that it was Malagon or Julio Gonzalez on the field, things would have changed against the US is what keeps Mexico there. The fact of the matter is that Ochoa is the only goalkeeper in Europe and people want him to step down for goalkeepers that aren't better than him and are in Liga MX. Liga MX IS the problem. But people don't want to recognize the US is a better team because they have better players. The only one that has a case is Santi about this and even then, it's one player.
     
    Serg33, NCCFBALL, Kaney and 1 other person repped this.
  2. Hecho en Chivas

    Hecho en Chivas Member+

    Apr 22, 2004
    Chulajuana
    Club:
    CD Chivas de Guadalajara
    Nat'l Team:
    Mexico
    Liga MX is definitely one of the biggest issues here. Getting rid of relegation, the 20/11 rule, increasing number of foreigners, no longer participating in CONMEBOL club tournaments, abolishing Copa MX, multi-club ownerships, playing bullshit MLS tournaments, etc. have completely set us back

    No doubt on a NT level, US has definitely improved and are now a step above Mexico. Just look how many young players they have in Europe. What I found absolutely mind boggling was during the post-game conference that even Jimmy said about the importance of sending players to Europe, yet this dumbass leaves Santi out of the lineup in favor over Martin. FMF is rotten to the core. I am sure there are certain guys imposed on by club owners and/or agents. Even Tuca had confirmed this during his time as interim coach and why he never wanted the gig full time. This also explains why coaches like Bielsa or Almada never got the job. They are the type of coaches that want full control but obviously FMF could never allow that.

    We should have seen legit changes after crashing out of the 2022 World Cup, if not even way before. But all we keep getting are empty promises. FMF needs to be completely demolished and rebuilt from the ground up. But nothing will happen as long as the business side is thriving, sponsorships keep growing, and owners make their millions
     
  3. AMLO2018

    AMLO2018 Member+

    Mexico
    Jul 12, 2012
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    Mexico
    Anybody here mentioned LigaMuy X owners pocketing $um$ sending trash ( Funes & Piojo ) instead of Santi & Lainez
     
    Romario'sgurl and Kaney repped this.
  4. Rafael Hernandez

    Rafael Hernandez Moderator
    Staff Member

    Mar 6, 2002
    Tuca implied that it was Ochoa who was imposed and then went research came, he didn't call him up the first time and called him up but only played him once. When he's unquestionably the best GK at that time. Right now he's still in Serie A while the rest of the goalkeepers are in Mexico and being dumb about it like after the World Cup when Acevedo said that it was a dream of him but for "us" it might not happen, when the guy was 26 as a GK and already with the conformista bullshit.

    Tuca is one of the problems with his BS about not playing youngsters and his coining the phrase about moleros that now has Mexico playing less and less non FIFA friendlies, which would be needed now to start giving players starts.

    The main thing is exporting players which is not the FMF but clubs. And fans are a huge part of it. Nobody mentions how one of the key things of our trouble is how the bronze medal winning team in 2021, had only Johan Vasquez leaving for Europe. A great performance WASTED. But Cruz Azul fans were happy in getting Carlos Rodriguez and Antuna later on. Chivas fans were happy with Alvarado, Rayados fans were happy with Romo and Tigres fans were happy with Cordova. As soon as a player comes to Europe they are all on board and "fvck the NT" until stuff like this happens.
     
    Serg33, Philip J. Fry and DGreat repped this.
  5. Miguel Myers

    Miguel Myers Member+

    Dec 3, 2011
    Club:
    Club América
    Nat'l Team:
    Mexico
    Mexico died in 2021

    in Cincy

    we are watching the die off

    just buckle up as we become a honduras who hopes to pull off a big game vs the USA (as in maybe a draw) at home come the next qualifiers
     
  6. Kaney

    Kaney Sleeping Dragon
    Staff Member

    Dec 12, 2005
    Lake County, IL AKA Southern Wisconsin
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Mexico
    The first and most important thing to do is to create a structure where the power of the federation is not derived from club owners... otherwise the federation is simply an arm of the owners who are looking to line their own pockets at the expense of the National Team.
     
    SGuerrilla, Hecho en Chivas and DGreat repped this.
  7. Plutarco Elias Calles

    Atletico San Pancho
    Mexico
    Sep 4, 2021
    It doesn't matter if Santi started they would have still lost. It's time to put a sock in it for the next 10 years. There's no one coming through the pipeline and guys like Chucky, Flores, and Lainez flopping in Europe has dropped the stock of Mexican players abroad.
     
    Athazagoraphobia repped this.
  8. Kaney

    Kaney Sleeping Dragon
    Staff Member

    Dec 12, 2005
    Lake County, IL AKA Southern Wisconsin
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Mexico
    Mexico will always produce talent but with the exception of a few clubs, the overall league structure and business culture is not conducive to actively developing talent...
     
    SGuerrilla and AMLO2018 repped this.
  9. Plutarco Elias Calles

    Atletico San Pancho
    Mexico
    Sep 4, 2021
    I think it's regressing and we're producing less
     
  10. TheDude47

    TheDude47 Member+

    Jun 17, 2010
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    Nat'l Team:
    Mexico
    it is so dry and it’s scary. Look I get that el Tri has had dark spots in its past before, but that doesn’t make this one any less worse. Back in the early 2000s you could point to a star player on each teams roster and they would be Mexican. Now, you would be lucky if you can find a national in a starting spot on a club team.
     
  11. Rafael Hernandez

    Rafael Hernandez Moderator
    Staff Member

    Mar 6, 2002
    That's not the problem. The problem is those type of stars and their level. You had a guy like Chiquito Sanchez, who constantly is touted as he has go to Europe and the best player in Liga MX, and he looks like this. As early as Cesar Montes, you had players that were too good for Liga MX show in Iinternational football that they are too good and now not even that.
     
  12. Athazagoraphobia

    Jul 28, 2012
    Vancouver
    Club:
    CF Atlas Guadalajara
    Nat'l Team:
    Mexico
    I think it’s time we acknowledge that we’re in a down cycle. We need someone who does more with less. Almada does that (and he does it with Mexican talent to boot).

    We already made a mistake in picking a coach whose only feat is a decent Olympic run. That’s it. We need to rectify this mistake and bring on Almada. Better late than never.
     
    Kaney and SGuerrilla repped this.
  13. Athazagoraphobia

    Jul 28, 2012
    Vancouver
    Club:
    CF Atlas Guadalajara
    Nat'l Team:
    Mexico
    I also think we give them too much credit. If you look at their players, a large chunk of their team relies on players neither raised nor developed domestically. Some were not even born on US soil. IMO, this creates a false sense of belief amongst fans whereby people think they’re better than they really are. The moment their recruitment fails to nourish the pipeline, the success stops.

    The following players (all of which played minutes yesterday) were not raised nor developed in the US.

    Musah, Johnny, Robinson, Dest, Balogun and Tillman.

    If we’re going to reform, I’d rather Mexico not base its system on one whose success depends almost exclusively on recruitment.
     
    Kaney, Chicago76 and SGuerrilla repped this.
  14. GrandeSoccer

    GrandeSoccer Member+

    Jun 20, 2010
    Club:
    Club América
    Nat'l Team:
    Mexico
    The "fvck the NT don't export anyone and I support bringing them back from europe all I care about is winning LigaMX trophies!" people are annoying and mediocre as fvck and are part of the problem which is why i ain't mad when their bum teams takes Ls in these garbage tournaments against MLS (something that would've been unthinkable for me in the early-mid 2010s when I ALWAYS supported Mexican teams in international club competitions) even though they don't lose very often because most of those MLS teams still suck ass for the most part ESPECIALLY when they go down to Mexico.

    I still blame Chaka Rodriguez for that bullshit... and to a lesser extent Guardado for making that no name keeper the hero by having his pk saved

    but IIRC Chaka gave up the most idiotic corner leading to the equalizer when we had like less than 10 mins left to play

    that win completely rejuvenated the nads, gave them crazy amounts of concidence after not having beaten us since 2013, and they've been coasting ever since.
     
    SGuerrilla, Kaney and Miguel Myers repped this.
  15. Plutarco Elias Calles

    Atletico San Pancho
    Mexico
    Sep 4, 2021
    That's true to to an extent, but it ws inevitable we would reach this point.

    The reason we still competed was because it was the last hoorah of the Guardado HH generation against a green nad team. Now they are in their prime and face the likes of Antuna and Martin
     
    SGuerrilla and GrandeSoccer repped this.
  16. GrandeSoccer

    GrandeSoccer Member+

    Jun 20, 2010
    Club:
    Club América
    Nat'l Team:
    Mexico
    yep it's over :(
     
  17. Rafael Hernandez

    Rafael Hernandez Moderator
    Staff Member

    Mar 6, 2002
    That was the Nations League final and it was played in Denver. The Cincy match was in the World Cup qualifiers.
     
    Kaney repped this.
  18. GrandeSoccer

    GrandeSoccer Member+

    Jun 20, 2010
    Club:
    Club América
    Nat'l Team:
    Mexico
    #12518 GrandeSoccer, Mar 26, 2024
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2024
    ohh, my bad

    yeah we got killed in that one too... But we could've probably won that final in Denver at least with a bit more focus and slightly less braindead plays, because we still had a decent amount of quality at the time that was able to go toe to toe with them, just a missed opportunity smh.
     
    Kaney repped this.
  19. Miguel Myers

    Miguel Myers Member+

    Dec 3, 2011
    Club:
    Club América
    Nat'l Team:
    Mexico
    That Moreno goal that got called back would’ve been the nail in the nads coffin

    shortly after, Reyna scored. Up to that point Mex was extremely comfortable
     
    SGuerrilla, Kaney and GrandeSoccer repped this.
  20. GrandeSoccer

    GrandeSoccer Member+

    Jun 20, 2010
    Club:
    Club América
    Nat'l Team:
    Mexico
    Oh man I forgot about that goal, really thought that was a wrap too, yet another Mexico win vs the nads, too ez, they're prepping the trophy for us.

    Welp....
     
  21. Serg33

    Serg33 Member+

    Jul 11, 2007
    Can't believe how simple it is to fix all of it...
     
  22. jreadusaf

    jreadusaf Member

    Jun 18, 2009
    Tübingen, Germany
    Club:
    Fulham FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    When I was growing up in the United States, academies weren't a thing, and the path to playing professionally didn't really exist minus a few anomalies. That is not the case today--over the past 30 years the shift in development has drastically improved in the United States and we are now seeing the benefits of this development. In addition, it is not out of the realm of possibilities to have a dual-national player represent the United States as a first choice because of our improvement, which wasn't necessarily the case in the past.

    I mention all of this to say that Mexico has always had quality players, and will continue to have quality players. Cycles ebb and flow and Mexico is in a transitional phase. I find it important to mention that the improvement in the United States doesn't mean that Mexico is regressing or needs to drastically overhaul how the youth is being developed. From my perspective, the quality increase in the United States has created a huge inferiority complex in Mexico, when in reality Mexico is going to be fine.
     
  23. Chicago76

    Chicago76 Member+

    Jun 9, 2002
    It's a bit of both really. The US has been fortunate to capitalize on recruitment and the player pool that isn't as tenuously tied to the country (whether completely homegrown or guys like McKennie) has improved. There are a very limited number of players floating around up to standard who are eligible for recruitment, so there will be a lot of volatility cycle to cycle in that respect. At times there simply won't be as many Dests, Baloguns, Musahs, etc available.

    That said, the caliber of player and the conversion rate of those who are eligible willing to accept the callup will almost certainly remain the same if not improve. It comes down to credibility. Compared to 10-15 years ago, the domestic league is better. The commercial prospects of that league are better. The domestic pool is deeper and generally more competitive. There are better domestic to Europe players around those potential recruits. And the number of players who have gone that route before has increased. It's less speculative than it was.

    And the quality of those accepting the call has increased over time. Guys like Dooley, Stewart and Regis in the 90s who received no interest at all from their other options. Then a guy like Fabian Johnson who was still fairly young who at least got youth callups from Germany and a mid 20s Jones who at best was looking at maybe sneaking his way onto a German Euro or WC roster as one of the last two selections situationally. And now a younger guy like Musah and Balogun who had more time on their side than Jones and was in a little better position to do the same for England for at least one of the next 2-3 cycles.

    The recruitment ceiling today is probably players like a Balogun or Musah from UEFA sides 1 to 8 or so and players who seem to be capable for being core starters for UEFA sides 9-25 or so...if a player is at least open to entertaining the idea.

    Mexico can't duplicate that sort of strategy to the same level. It's a function of military presence and immigration or in the case of Gulf States, having a central government with cash willing to naturalize guys and pour money into their FAs accepting negative ROIs. Mexico is down primarily due to talent ebbs and flows but investing in player development at the club level is needed for sure.

    Some people here act as if Mexico is slipping down to Honduras levels. Not that transfermarkt is a perfect representation of the talent pool of various American sides, but it's fairly accurate: Brazil (EUR927mm), Argentina (728mm), Uruguay (408mm), USA (312mm), Ecuador (244mm), Colombia (224mm), Mexico (210mm), Canada (187mm), Paraguay {123mm), Chile (75mm). No one else over 40mm. Down a bit but hardly in shambles. Mexico will be fine.
     
    jreadusaf repped this.
  24. Miguel Myers

    Miguel Myers Member+

    Dec 3, 2011
    Club:
    Club América
    Nat'l Team:
    Mexico
    Mexicos just had the most embarrassing participation in a World Cup in decades, and it’s as if no alarms went off.

    They used the gold cup and some insane bandaid, it was just a façade

    Mexico has lost players abroad like Arteaga, Lainez, Flores, and is on its way to lose more players.

    clubs are severely overvaluing their players. Erik Sanchez of Pachuca was priced at 12 mill. On a good day, he’s maybe 5.

    Two out of three of the main forwards are 32 or older. One still hasn’t been the same since his serious head injury.

    we’ve seen a drastic downfall in the attitude of the average player. The Edson types are now considered rare.

    if mexico were to pick things up, it won’t be anytime prior to the next World Cup.

    in fact I think we will be back to these conversations right around the first KO game of the Copa America.

    I’ll happily eat crow if I’m wrong
    So far that hasn’t happened
     
  25. la fresa

    la fresa Member+

    Oct 31, 2005
    texas
    Club:
    Serbian White Eagles
    Sobering reality. Just to add I faith in Lozano but it quickly faded seeing him incapable or unwilling to let go of some players who should obviously not be there
     
    SGuerrilla and Kaney repped this.

Share This Page