Remon needs to tinker with the Starting 11....

although im not a beckham or owen hater....


perez will get pissed


id rather see owen up front instead of morientes....so if levekusen beat kiev....RM are out???

 

In the other thread, I posted:

---------------Casillas
Salgado--Helguera--Pavon---RCarlos
Figo----------Guti-------------Zidane
--------------Raul
-------Ronaldo-----Moro

I think that, honestly, Pavon has been playing better than Samuel in the last few games. I think Samuel's worlds better overall, but this season has not been a good one for Walt. Beckham = garbage; sell him off to Chelsea if they still want him -- works hard, hits good long balls and dead balls, but is a defensive joke, can't play the intricate balls Real utilize often, and too often just runs for the sake of running. I loved how we were playing with Morientes in the second half, so I think we start he, Raul, and Ronaldo, and Owen and Solari off the bench to mix things up. Morientes is a valuable asset because he is finally the target for Figo, ZIdane, Guti, RCarlos, and Salgado's crosses that they've needed.

 

This team starts players based on the players' performance for Manchester United in 1999 and Brazil in 2002. And I am getting very pissed.

 

Totally agree about benching Samuel. I realize he will eventually come around, but how much more suffering does the team endure?

I understand the logic in benching Beckham & Ronaldo, but I say it a different way. We just never know when any given Galactico is going to show up & play. When they are on, they are the best in the world. When they are off, they stink. I don't have a problem with them starting if the poor performers come off at the half. That should be an incentive without having a war in the dressing room. If that doesn't work, then start benching for a game.

Remember we are constantly at war with Chelsea, Barcelon, ect for new signings. RM does pretty well in picking up new stars based on how we treat the Galacticos. GR must find the path of fairness here.

 

Cassilas
Salgado-Mejia-Helguera-RC
Figo-Guti-Zidane-Raul
Owen/Moro-Ronaldo

That's the team that has to start. If Ronaldo produces another sluggish, lame performance take him off and bring on whoever is on the bench from Moro-Owen.
If raul, Zidane or Figo look off, bring on Solari.
If RC makes stupid defensive errors, bring on Raul Bravo.
If Guti keeps losing the ball, play Beckham... or maybe not

 

First of all I would bench Beckham. I didn't think he worked in the side a year ago and I still dont. Secondly I would bring in Mejia into the back line. Samuel and Helguera are playing clumsily and are showing the pressure all the time. Secondly Ronaldo and Raul are off form, they should be started on the bench for a few games to wake them up. Owen is in red hot form at the moment and you bench him all the time? He has really earned his place in the first 11 at the moment. Morientes should be played more.

The problem is businessman Florentino Perez. The side is predictable and overplayed because he has to have his shirtsellers on show. Beckham won't be benched, much as I would like to see it. Neither will darling Raul or Ronaldo.

I can't see this team winning anything this year. I think the ambitions and morale of the forwards took a knock last year because after scoring lots of goals and working their butts off in every game we lost all three competitions purely because we sucked at the back and everyone knew it. All our offensive players are off-form so far this season. (apart from Owen who has woken up after 2 years)

 

The team most likely to win without putting too much pressure on the superstars would be:

---------------Casillas
Salgado---Samuel--Mejia---RCarlos
-------------Helguera
Figo----------Zidane------Solari
-------Owen--------Ronaldo

Morientes, Guti, Raul and Beckham can be subs. However, I do not think Beckham will ever be needed. This formation allows Zidane to play in the middle and lets R Carlos and Solari interchange positions the way Carlos and Ze Roberto do for Brazil. It also allows Ronaldo space to operate. If Guti needs to play, he can play as CM and Zidane can move to LM. If only GR had the balls...

 

I wonder if any Real fans regret not getting Viera? Or instead of getting Owen or the still injured Woody, you had gotten a good holding midfielder like Maniche. Because i hate to say it your defense is terribe. Barca destroyed you, leverkusen has done the same. I think until Real achieves a greater balance between offense and defense, you will keep struggling. If you make it to the next round of the CL, you will limp in.

Though it sounds like I am trolling, I'd say to play to pure defensive midfielders to cover your defense. No wonder Samuel does poorly with all that space left in back after Salgado and Carlos are caught up field. A good defensive mid helps cover the defense and means Zidane, Figo, etc... can play their magic up front and not have to come back so much.

 

Actually you are only the 913th person to make the defensive mid comment in this forum. We have a thread "who will be the next galactico" which has been going on for some time - its predecessor went even longer. After seeing the extremly high salary that Viera was asking for, and having seen him play against Manchester City recently - where he looked very ordinary, and having so many commentators point out that one of Viera's legs is longer than the other, and that his career is on the decline, we have not heard the Viera comment for some time. We decided to save the 50 million euro estimated price for Viera and play Guti in that position. If he does well he gets a 50K Euro bonus.

 

I regret Florentino not getting Xabi.

Hopefully the 'signing' of Robinho is an indication that we will get the 'galacticos' at a younger age, and thus a cheaper price. Because then we woulnd't be foolish enough to let someone like Xabi go for the relatively cheap price we could have gotten him.

 

As far as Remon goes, he'd better learn from his mistakes. Because subbing in Morientes for Beckham when other players have as much reason to go to the bench (seriously, Beckham wasn't playing much worse than Ronaldo, at least with Beckham you still see him running down the field...as Marca says: it's always the same people that get subbed, and some never do) and seriously, I wanted to slap him silly just like everybody in the stadium when he wanted to sub in Solari in the last minute. That might just be a tad bit too late to sub someone in (just maybe) especially when the game of some players called for a much earlier subbing.

Yesterday you also see why Guti is either loved or hated by the people; because he either plays really great, or really [censored] bad. ¿Did a good pass even come from his feet? Goddamn.

The only silver lining is that we could have easily won this game in the 2nd half, but then that makes the loss even harder to bear.

As for making this post more on-topic instead of talking about the game: some of the players shouldn't be playing just because they *can* play fantastically better than others, but if they actually do. Of course Ronaldo is a more dangerous and dynamic forward to play than Morientes and Owen, when he is in form. The only problem is that he isn't in form, and is playing worse than both those other strikers even on their normal days.

 

As far as the Solari sub goes, it makes me question everything GRemon does. Solari is a brilliant player, but it is an idiotic move. First of all, a winger will probably not change a game dramitically immediately, like a striker can -- they're out on the side, working to get back defensively, and don't have the ball all the time. Second of all, we had tons of momentum all second half, and were in the third minute of the four extra minutes. WHY WOULD YOU WASTE 30 SECONDS/A MINUTE TO BRING IN A SUB WHEN YOU ONLY HAVE A FEW MORE SECONDS!? Subbing in extra time is a tactic a team uses when they are winning to waste time!!! Why do it when you aren't winning!? It makes no sense. I wish we had seen Solari earlier, for Guti or Beckham. I liked Morientes in there; hopefully GRemon finds a way to play Raul, Ronnie, and Owen, and bring Owen in for whichever of them is playing the worst in around the 70th minute.

Losses like this one are so frustrating -- when we can't finish well, like vs Bayer, it makes all of our pretty play and passing pointless. Much simpler, direct, less elegant play, like most other teams use, often is much more succesful.

 

Agree with all your points, gazzad_5, Oscar, & kaberon10. I have the PSV Eindhoven-Arsenal game on right now. First time I have seen von Bommel play & he looks much better to me than Viera. Going back to the missed opportunities of the summer - wouldn't we have had to pay a higher price than Liverpool for Alonso? Perez didn't want to play that game. I wish we would have taken the Samuel money & gone after Carvahlo. Hindsight is always 20-20 though. We were happy for Samuel at the time.

Speaking of great comments from the Spanish papers, I loved that AS line that RM plays football like a chess game - one piece moves at a time.

 

I agree with most of you guys, but am I the only one the sees the light in the end of the tunnel??
I think we are going UP from here, I really think we will only get better because we are seeing who is worth to play match time, and we can’t simply bench world class players with out giving them the chance especially when they cost an arm and a leg to buy them.
Well, they had there chance and know we know who is worth there pay check…
I think that we are learning valuable lessons as we play every week, but we need to translate them into winning games at this point forward, no more learning, we know everything we need to know.
We are not doing bad at all, were second in LA Liga and need a win the next game to qualify in the CL (and so does a lot of other teams) don’t forget were playing against a team that is REALLY going through a crisis (unlike us) and don’t really have anything to play for.

We are doing much better than most of you think, and the way we played most of the second half yesterday makes me see the light.
Against Barca we played the same players that played the first half of the BL game and obviously was the wrong decision.


------------Casillas
Salgado--Helguera--Pavon---RCarlos
Figo----------Guti-------------Zidane
--------------Raul
-Ronaldo/Owen-----Moro

 

Much better than you think? A draw against a 2nd rate side at home is nothing to open the champagne over. And we are learning? I wish I saw more evidence from that from GR. His moves are pretty much incomprehensible to me. I am not without hope, but lets start seeing some better moves from management.

 

I think (hope) we will from this point forward but who knows?
It could stay the same but I have a feeling it will be up from this point.
We shall see

by the way I think EL Moro is a key to the teams success and until RM figure this out we will continue to suffer (yes, he is that good)

 

And he too, needs to figure out how to score free headers inside the 6 yard box.
Viera just went off for a 2nd yellow.
Back to your point, I think Ronaldo should have come off at half time & been replaced by Morientes.

 

True, I was really pissed when I saw that, but u must admit he played 10 times better in 30 mints than Ronaldo did all season.
Plus, playing the last 5 mints for the past 20 games (if that) would leave you out of shape, need to play more to be 100% and that goes for El Moro too.

 

Agreed. Beckham as the CM basically meant taking Zidane away from the center of things. He has done well in the center(okay, his defensive skills were not good, but so were every single CM we tried). He is making Zidane ineffective this season. I do not understand why Figo was never tried at CM. I knew he has been great on the RM and should stay there, but if Remon or Perez insisted on playing Beckham, Figo should try on the CM while beckham plays on the RM for a chance.

BTW, how about Figo on the left and Beckham on the right.... Zidane and Guti on the middle.

 

No Raul in the playing XI? Heresay!!!! But I do think that Raul pr Zidane behind 2 from Owen/Moro/Ronaldo, and the rest of the line-up as Kaushik has described (ok pavon for Samuel) is our best formation.